Fri Mar 9 Horse Lake at Stony Plain

[sam]

Although all your comments are very interesting to read I thought a quick breakdown of what actually happened would be nice so people reading this can clearly understand the situation.

First off I will start by saying Horselake did break the 6 import rule in Friday night’s game; this is going back to Hockey Alberta and being protested. The illegal import player was not Ben Boudreau it was Jaime Routledge an A/P from Carstairs, his card was still with Lloydminster even though he had been an active player in Carstairs all year. The final roster that was issued following the February 10th deadline from Hockey Alberta did not list Jaime Routledge as an import player but rather just an A/P from Carstairs. Horselake would have acquired his card from Carstairs and would have submitted that through Hockey Alberta. I am not placing blame by any means as this is still going to be sent back to Hockey Alberta rather just providing some information as to why Horselake did not follow the rule. (Derton did not play on Saturday for reasons aside from the import rule; he left Friday’s game in the 3rd period.) It would be out right crazy for a team to travel to your first round game of the AAA Finals to play a hard game, win just to know that it is going to be taken away based on a technicality that may have been something out of Horselakes control. I agree with the statement about checking the rosters beforehand we do have enough technology these days that you are more than capable of pulling an active roster from Hockey Alberta or going through it before hand, especially considering both Ray Marsh and his son were at the game on Friday and Saturday in Stony Plain.

I highly doubt at this point the game will return to HorseLakes favor, regardless of the win but I think it is important that people reading this understand that sometimes things are not as they seem. Horselake has had illegal player issues before along with many other teams throughout Hockey Alberta and I’m sure across the country. Horselake is excited to be where they are in the playoffs and are working just as hard as any other team on the ice in Alberta or across Canada. I have no doubt that they will come back against Stony in the games this weekend, the unfortunate loss at this point is the lack of encouragement from Hockey Alberta to ensure information is passed on correctly to teams throughout the league. We all know it would never be posted that “ Horselake loses their first game because of an illegal player, that in fact was never listed as in import to begin with from Hockey Alberta “. They are working hard and want to win just the same as anyone else. This was an unfortunate situation and hopefully can be reviewed for some answers as to why it happened. Horselake has gone through two series already and come out on top of them, there is no denying that they are playing their hearts out, trying hard and deserve to be where they are.

It seems like there is a lack of information in the realm of Horselake and everyone seems to be speculating as to what is happening. Let’s not forget everyone out there involved in this fans, player and management alike are all out with the same interest at heart.

[proview]

So if I am getting this at all ,Horslake did not know he was an import, because hockey alberta never had him listed as an import and then they take the win away,for being an import. If thats even close thats total BS and must be overturned.

[sam]

Yes, that is why Horselake is gathering the information from February 10th to appeal to Hockey Alberta. In the technical sense Horselake played an illegal player yes, but like I stated above more to that story than just what is written on the websites. Hopefully Hockey Alberta will do the right thing and give this a proper look back. The boys played hard and deserved that win just the same as if this happened to any other team.

[hockeypops]

Sorry Sam but I have the roster that was printed off the HCR and sent to me on Feb 21st and Jamie Routledge shows both as an A/P and Import so anything your claiming is sounding alarms off for me. In addition my remarks about who was the extra import were based on who was shown on the roster sheet on the Chinook League site and Jamie Rutledge does not show up so I was going by the only odd man out that had not appeared previously and was listed as an import, but mark my words, I have the print out of the HCR HL roster that was provided to the Chinook League teams so we had the final roster and status of every HL player and affiliate and Routledge is the last name on the list and CLEARLY marked A/P and Import as is Roger Maxwell and Ryan McLeaod. As for just an import and not A/P it is Ben Boudreau, Tyler Brough, Andrew Derton, Steve Later, Kip Noble, and a Goaltender Cory McEachran. Don't think the problem lies with HA but might suggest that HL take a second look at the HCR of their own team.

[sam]

Fair enough, guess we will have to see what comes from this. Like I previously stated I don’t think this will be overturn because of the situation but I did feel it was important to lay the information out. With a high level of hockey being played here we may need to step up with the times and find ways to challenge information at the start of a game not after a team loses. That comes from both the standpoint of knowing who is an import or not on your own team as well as being able to properly prove otherwise.

[hockeypops]

Mar 12, 2012 15:18:33 GMT -5 sam said:

Fair enough, guess we will have to see what comes from this. Like I previously stated I don’t think this will be overturn because of the situation but I did feel it was important to lay the information out. With a high level of hockey being played here we may need to step up with the times and find ways to challenge information at the start of a game not after a team loses. That comes from both the standpoint of knowing who is an import or not on your own team as well as being able to properly prove otherwise.

I hear your frustration but really think the HL management screwed up because all I have is a print out of the HL roster from the HCR and there is no doubt about the status of Jamie Routledge. Below is what the HCR list looks like and I think it's pretty clear. Don't think the HL protest will do a thing and if they're posting the fee for a protest, it will just help bolster the HA's bottom line.


PLAYER STATUS........I A
PLAYER BEN BOUDREAU x
PLAYER TYLER BROUGH x
PLAYER ANDREW DERTON x
PLAYER STEVE LATER x
GOALTENDER CORY MCEACHRAN x
PLAYER KIP NOBLE x
PLAYER ROGER MAXWELL x x
PLAYER RYAN MCLEOD x x
PLAYER JAMIE R ROUTLEDGE x x

[sam]

I can only state what I know and that is all I have done, I wanted to shed light on the fact that yes HL did improperly play the player, however; the roster from February 10th does not relect the one posted above. That it is all.

As also previously stated I think HL will come back and so I am less than concerned but really only time will tell. These men are all very talanted in these leagues and I am proud of all the teams that come out to play. Sometimes clerical issues from teams, organizations so on and so forth get in the way of the game. But with that being said rules are made to be followed and keep everyone on track.

[wade]

Mar 12, 2012 15:55:26 GMT -5 sam said:

I can only state what I know and that is all I have done, I wanted to shed light on the fact that yes HL did improperly play the player, however; the roster from February 10th does not relect the one posted above. That it is all.

As also previously stated I think HL will come back and so I am less than concerned but really only time will tell. These men are all very talanted in these leagues and I am proud of all the teams that come out to play. Sometimes clerical issues from teams, organizations so on and so forth get in the way of the game. But with that being said rules are made to be followed and keep everyone on track.

Good post & thank you for the clarity, sam.

[hockeypops]

Mar 12, 2012 15:55:26 GMT -5 sam said:

I can only state what I know and that is all I have done, I wanted to shed light on the fact that yes HL did improperly play the player, however; the roster from February 10th does not relect the one posted above. That it is all.

As also previously stated I think HL will come back and so I am less than concerned but really only time will tell. These men are all very talanted in these leagues and I am proud of all the teams that come out to play. Sometimes clerical issues from teams, organizations so on and so forth get in the way of the game. But with that being said rules are made to be followed and keep everyone on track.

This list is just a small part of the entire roster but is in fact a replication of the actual list dated Feb 14, 2012 copied from the HCR. As HL is not in the Chinook League, coaches and managers do not have access to seeing their roster. Within the Chinook League, players and coaches can see every other teams complete roster but as of yet HL can't be seen and HL can't see the Chinook League teams. HL can see every team from the NPHL though so what was done as playoffs started was each team was provided with a direct copy from the HCR of the other teams roster so each would know the roster and status of every player. Considering Routledge was put into the HCR as an affiliate to HL on Jan 15th, the deadline for affiliates, it seems unlikely to me the computer made a mistake from Jan 15th to Feb 10th and corrected itself Feb 12th.
But let's take this one step at a time. Routledge played for Lloydminster in 09-10 and doesn't appear anywhere in Alberta for 10-11 so when he joined Carstairs some time in early November of this season there were two things that needed to happen. Step 1 was creating a request for a card transfer from Lloydminster a Sask team. That means he HAD to be recorded on the Carstairs roster as an import or the HCR would not allow the request to be completed and would reject the request. 2 Carstairs had to wait until his card was transfered before he would be allowed to play and that means checking the staus of import or no import. He first played in SL on Nov 19. Now the minute HL wanted to affiliate him and requested the affiliation a simple process occurs. The player has to be a carded player on a team in a lower division. Easy Carstairs was AA so everythings fine. Next step is, his profile from Carstairs is added as an affiliate under HL. If what you say is true then his import status was not in the Carstairs roster all year. It can't happen any other way because of how the HCR works, an affiliates entire status is just linked to the affiliating teams roster.

I'll go back to what I said before, a HL team official didn't check close enough.

[hockeypops]

Mar 12, 2012 16:23:11 GMT -5 wade said:

Mar 12, 2012 15:55:26 GMT -5 sam said:

I can only state what I know and that is all I have done, I wanted to shed light on the fact that yes HL did improperly play the player, however; the roster from February 10th does not relect the one posted above. That it is all.

As also previously stated I think HL will come back and so I am less than concerned but really only time will tell. These men are all very talanted in these leagues and I am proud of all the teams that come out to play. Sometimes clerical issues from teams, organizations so on and so forth get in the way of the game. But with that being said rules are made to be followed and keep everyone on track.

Good post & thank you for the clarity, sam.

Wade YOU'RE not suggesting computers make mistakes are you

[sam]

So, and dont jump at my throat as I said before I am trying to understand and simply stating what I know.

So if Jaime was playing in Carstairs this year and was not listed as an import all year than he shouldnt have been listed as an import for HL?

Can you provide some more information on that, like I said I am trying to understand. I understand why HL didnt see him as an import, but I dont understand why he would be considered an import if he was currently carded with Carstairs.

Thanks!

[hockeypops]

Mar 12, 2012 16:49:43 GMT -5 sam said:

So, and dont jump at my throat as I said before I am trying to understand and simply stating what I know.

So if Jaime was playing in Carstairs this year and was not listed as an import all year than he shouldnt have been listed as an import for HL?

Can you provide some more information on that, like I said I am trying to understand. I understand why HL didnt see him as an import, but I dont understand why he would be considered an import if he was currently carded with Carstairs.

Thanks!

My point was, Routledge was and is an import for this season and the reason he is, has to do with the fact he was last carded in Saskatchewan. I was merely making a point that there is a near imposiibility he showed up on Feb 10 as a non-import and Feb 14 as an import on the HCR HL roster. His status in Carstairs for this season was an import. Would be very interesting to see what document HL has that shows him as regular status. Everything I have seen clearly shows him as an import.

[hockeypops]

Sam I can tell you that there is another copy of the HL HCR roster taken around Feb 1st or 2nd as Fort Sask was given a copy of the roster prior to their playoff series. Routledge would have been listed on that with his status because all A/P's were listed by Jan 15. The Fort Sask Coach and Managers needed the information for HL roster verification. Not a document I was privee to seeing.

[sam]

You may very well be correct you sound like you are on the ball with the information, as I stated several times I can only shed light on the information I know.

This is going to be all the more reason for HL to come out next weekend and play as hard as they can which should make for some great hockey, which is what we are all interested in.

Perhaps Stony Plain was worried about the series in order to take this step, that should be incentive for HL to play even harder. They beat Fort Sask, they beat Bentley and they are still in this series you can not count them out and this is a speed bump on the road to the Allan Cup.

[hockeypops]

Mar 12, 2012 17:17:21 GMT -5 sam said:

You may very well be correct you sound like you are on the ball with the information, as I stated several times I can only shed light on the information I know.

This is going to be all the more reason for HL to come out next weekend and play as hard as they can which should make for some great hockey, which is what we are all interested in.

Perhaps Stony Plain was worried about the series in order to take this step, that should be incentive for HL to play even harder. They beat Fort Sask, they beat Bentley and they are still in this series you can not count them out and this is a speed bump on the road to the Allan Cup.

There are defenitely times Coaches and Managers twist their words to suit their situation. I do agree that HL is still a force to be reconned with and there's a lot of hockey yet before the fat lady sings.