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Post by wade on Mar 18, 2023 20:10:39 GMT -5
Sounds like NFLD team is being serious on taking the 4th spot in the Tournament. Sounds like Stony Plain has made a tough reverse decision on participating And idea which team? Hoping Clarenville. They have great organization I can’t see how any Newfoundland teams could commit? They’re having a Herder Series during the same time the Dundas Tournament is happening.
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Post by mlh01 on Mar 18, 2023 22:18:15 GMT -5
And idea which team? Hoping Clarenville. They have great organization I can’t see how any Newfoundland teams could commit? They’re having a Herder Series during the same time the Dundas Tournament is happening. Clarenville was eliminated in quarter finals. They’d be likely choice as their season is already over.
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Post by mlh01 on Mar 18, 2023 22:22:36 GMT -5
And remember this is a new beginning. Essentially trying to get the old lady (Allan is her name 🙂) back in the groove. This year is a “Challenge for the Allan Cup”. Not a series of champions. Open season.
Goal is to get more teams interested in AAA.
Once interest is tweaked again, the second goal is how to make it affordable to travel / host an Allan Cup
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Post by outwest95 on Mar 19, 2023 9:23:39 GMT -5
Clarenville, Innisfail, Dundas, and Ontario team. Unless something drastic changes in the next few weeks.
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Post by sprintcars on Mar 19, 2023 13:16:08 GMT -5
How would the teams from NFLD be eligible when they are basically AA not AAA any more
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Post by outwest95 on Mar 19, 2023 18:36:16 GMT -5
How would the teams from NFLD be eligible when they are basically AA not AAA any more this year and it sounds like moving forward it will be an invitational event for AA and AAA teams to compete for. Clarenville could up players from the other 4 teams in the herder cup, along with guys from their own team. This isn’t out of ordinary as it as usually been sone in years prior.
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Post by southoftheborder on Mar 20, 2023 5:09:19 GMT -5
How would the teams from NFLD be eligible when they are basically AA not AAA any more The difference between Senior AAA and Senior AA is a touchy subject in Newfoundland.
Teams in Newfoundland nearly destroyed senior hockey in the province battling over one team pretty much well being AAA while playing in AA leagues as accusations were made of players being paid under the table by one team to play and this nearly killed off senior hockey in the province as teams were being excluded from playing in leagues due to this accusation, which apparently weren't proven with the excuse being given that they made the team a five team league and scheduling was more difficult with an odd number of teams. Hockey NL stepped in and after having a sitdown meeting with all of the teams involved returned the accused team to the league they had just be excluded from. It was a total mess and got stranger. The Newfoundland Senior Hockey League had all but one of its' members vote to withdraw from the league and reform the Avalon East Senior Hockey League excluding the accused team. The simple solution would have been having the team join the Central/West Senior Hockey League but the team wasn't accepted into that league despite if they were added they would give the league four teams and make scheduling easier and give teams more games.
The pandemic didn't help the situation either.
Registration deadlines have not meant much in senior hockey over the last decade or so as Hockey Canada doesn't put that high of a priority on the Allan Cup. And each province has their own set of deadlines which all seem fairly flexible as needed.
Before the issues within Newfoundland senior hockey came to head, the previous year's Herder Cup champion would represent the province in Allan Cup qualifying. If this was the case the Southern Shore Breakers would have been the province's representative for this year's Allan Cup.
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Post by southoftheborder on Mar 20, 2023 5:21:06 GMT -5
Clarenville, Innisfail, Dundas, and Ontario team. Unless something drastic changes in the next few weeks. Too bad this didn't break earlier. The AESHL and Herder series in Newfoundland could have been cut down to best-of-five series and it might have worked out to have this year's Herder champion participate in the Allan Cup.
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Post by mlh01 on Mar 20, 2023 22:45:57 GMT -5
Clarenville, Innisfail, Dundas, and Ontario team. Unless something drastic changes in the next few weeks. Too bad this didn't break earlier. The AESHL and Herder series in Newfoundland could have been cut down to best-of-five series and it might have worked out to have this year's Herder champion participate in the Allan Cup. To be honest, that wouldn’t have mattered. It’s not about the best team entering. It’s about the best organization. I met a few of the Clarenville contingent when they played in the 2014 Allan Cup down here. And have even gone to some games out on the Rock. They are a very very solid Senior A organization. Since the league toned down with fewer ex-pros, and the caliber of players wasn’t as strong, it coincided with fewer sponsors. Covid then reared its ugly head. Then, as you mention it was almost the death of Senior hockey. Add to it, in previous years the winner of the AA league would declare AAA for the following season, and subsequently would have a year to fundraise. So given there is only a month to go, I feel Clarenville is the only team on the Rock who can pull it off. And hopefully they can add 4-5 players to allow them a competitive team to battle Ontario and Alberta.
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Post by dontcallitsenior on Mar 21, 2023 7:57:16 GMT -5
I understand the concept of a challenge cup and Clarenville being a last-minute addition, but adding players at this stage when all other AAA teams have had their rosters finalized a long time ago doesn't seem right.
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Post by southoftheborder on Mar 21, 2023 16:29:54 GMT -5
I understand the concept of a challenge cup and Clarenville being a last-minute addition, but adding players at this stage when all other AAA teams have had their rosters finalized a long time ago doesn't seem right. Isn't that what they used to do in the old East-West days with both the Memorial and Allan Cup playoffs?
I also remember a few years ago that the Central/West Senior Hockey League champion was allowed a few players to strengthen their roster when they were playing for the Herder against the champion of the Newfoundland Senior Hockey League.
I would think if they wanted to expand the number of teams competing for the Allan Cup they should have Senior AA league all-star teams play down for spot in the tournament. Thay would give 30+ teams excluding the two Senior AAA leagues. The leagues could do league-wide 50-50 draws or Chase the Ace events to raise funds to support the All-Star teams.
In reality Senior hockey has been dying a long painful death since the invention of television. Hockey Night in Canada television broadcasts gave fans in many medium sized cities across the nation the option of seeing the NHL on television in stead of getting high calibre senior hockey at their local rink.
This level of play is working guys dealing with having to provide for their families with full time jobs while playing a game they love. I don't know how many can afford to take time off from work without burning all of their vacation time or has a boss that can afford to be down the help for the day or two each series would take on a road trip for each round, and then needing a week for the Allan Cup tournament itself.
If you really wanted to go old school how about having universities compete for the Allan Cup again.
They need to try something to get the Senior level back to at least some level of stability. Either going back to what used to work or thinking outside the box is what it may take to get over the hump to stabilize senior hockey
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Post by mlh01 on Mar 21, 2023 22:05:12 GMT -5
I understand the concept of a challenge cup and Clarenville being a last-minute addition, but adding players at this stage when all other AAA teams have had their rosters finalized a long time ago doesn't seem right. Actually this is not out of the ordinary. Newfoundland, in all of the modern day era tournaments were granted an exemption. This allowed them to add 4-5 players. They did this during the 2014 Cup here in Dundas. Although….read on. It really wasn’t an exemption under Hockey Canada rules. We also need to put this in perspective. Newfoundland is an island with a population of approx 500,000 people. That is less than the amalgamated city of Hamilton (which includes the 22k who live here in Dundas. The 4 teams in our league have over 15 million people in the small area called the “Golden Horseshoe” to build teams from. Therefore the only way to allow the smaller provinces a fighting chance is to allow pickups. Secondly - we can actually do the same in Ontario. Alberta too ….by adding “AA” AP players. In fact we did it here in Dundas. Seasoned McCoys fans will remember that we added big D MacMillan after his AA season in Southwest Ontario was done. I remember at least two years he joined us for the Cup run. What would happen is the previous years winner would declare “AAA” for the following season in Newfoundland. The rest of the teams in NFLD would play as “AA”. Thus allowing them to pickup AP “AA” players fair and square. Only difference in 2023 is this is such short notice that Clarenville didn’t declare AAA. But let’s be honest. That is just semantics. I will be thrilled if they can pull this off. Looking forward to seeing the Caribous again !!! ** Please feel free to add to my comments above. All are my recollection of how the Allan Cup has run for the last 25 years with regards to NFLD adding pickups.
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Post by wade on Mar 22, 2023 0:14:09 GMT -5
Why have any roster regulations at all? Let teams bring whoever they can rustle up for the week.
It’s not as if there is going to be anyone actually enforcing what’s left of the SR AAA guidelines
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Post by southoftheborder on Mar 22, 2023 3:16:19 GMT -5
I understand the concept of a challenge cup and Clarenville being a last-minute addition, but adding players at this stage when all other AAA teams have had their rosters finalized a long time ago doesn't seem right. Actually this is not out of the ordinary. Newfoundland, in all of the modern day era tournaments were granted an exemption. This allowed them to add 4-5 players. They did this during the 2014 Cup here in Dundas. Although….read on. It really wasn’t an exemption under Hockey Canada rules. We also need to put this in perspective. Newfoundland is an island with a population of approx 500,000 people. That is less than the amalgamated city of Hamilton (which includes the 22k who live here in Dundas. The 4 teams in our league have over 15 million people in the small area called the “Golden Horseshoe” to build teams from. Therefore the only way to allow the smaller provinces a fighting chance is to allow pickups. Secondly - we can actually do the same in Ontario. Alberta too ….by adding “AA” AP players. In fact we did it here in Dundas. Seasoned McCoys fans will remember that we added big D MacMillan after his AA season in Southwest Ontario was done. I remember at least two years he joined us for the Cup run. What would happen is the previous years winner would declare “AAA” for the following season in Newfoundland. The rest of the teams in NFLD would play as “AA”. Thus allowing them to pickup AP “AA” players fair and square. Only difference in 2023 is this is such short notice that Clarenville didn’t declare AAA. But let’s be honest. That is just semantics. I will be thrilled if they can pull this off. Looking forward to seeing the Caribous again !!! ** Please feel free to add to my comments above. All are my recollection of how the Allan Cup has run for the last 25 years with regards to NFLD adding pickups. If I remember correctly, having the tournament in Dundas, which is not too far from Toronto may be one of if not the cheapest trip for a team from Newfoundland to have outside of the Atlantic Provinces. I thought most of the normal plane routes in St. John's go through either Halifax or Toronto. It's either a long bus ride (with a long ferry crossing) or a plane ride to any place else.
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Post by sprintcars on Mar 22, 2023 14:04:47 GMT -5
maybe add some strict rules like AA hockey This would definitely open up the number of teams eligible to compete
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